Daniel José Older is a writer on the rise, and Tor recently published his chilling and compelling urban fantasy short story Anyway: Angie.
Daniel was kind enough to join me for a Twitter chat, where we talked about everything from channeling darkness into writing, channeling the voice of a character who is very different from you, and the importance of Twitter to the modern writer.
Check it out:
.@djolder What is it about urban fantasy that is so appealing? Is this the new mythology for the city? #AnywayAngie
— Nathan Bransford (@NathanBransford) March 29, 2014
When you live in a place a while, the streets themselves become like books. Buildings, graffiti, train tracks offer up stories #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
The gossip on the corner, in the bodega, at the domino table. All this is oral tradition, urban fantasy in its own way #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
Storytelling at its roots, the conversation – this is how i approach writing. It reminds me where the craft came from #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
So this is where the appeal of mythology and the city comes in: there is a truth vibrating through, the city is full of stories #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
.@djolder Is there also a sense that we live in these seemingly gleaming cities but there are some ugly things lurking beneath? #AnywayAngie
— Nathan Bransford (@NathanBransford) March 29, 2014
Yes and no. Often traditional urban fantasy offers up a lot of “dark underbelly” narratives that are really coded racist tropes #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
So we see the very basic and old-fashioned cliches going on, magical or evil people of color and the city as “Ghetto Hell” #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
Without much nuance for the reality of community that happens in urban areas, the way it can uplift you, the power. #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
Meanwhile, the really ugly things go largely ignored in a lot of mainstream urban fantasy: gentrification, police brutality. #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
And some of that’s b/c a lot of UF writers don’t live in the communities they represent, but it’s also b/c that’s the dominant #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
narrative about The City, The Inner City, that the media feeds us. So when Charo has his realization in #AnywayAngie he’s seeing this truth
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
It’s a complicated, messy truth and it’s hard to get at, as a writer, as a human being, as an organizer. That’s our challenge #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
.@djolder Right. Seems like you counter those urban fantasy cliches by making the city in #AnywayAngie the site of a very personal horror?
— Nathan Bransford (@NathanBransford) March 29, 2014
Yes, that’s well put. Reza is haunted not by a ghost but by an uncertainty. Also, her past won’t leave her alone… #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
And the streets harbor all those memories. There’s a power in those streets, it gives and it drains. Reza’s fighting that. #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
So it’s about the power of place to conjure memory, and it’s about healing. Charo, Reza’s community in a way, is instrumental #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
Having so many shared experiences, he gets her in ways no one else can. Here’s healing/haunting based on place and people #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
These are things that the gentrification convo often disregards – how crucial community, people & place, is in our healing #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
.@djolder What’s the best way for writers to channel dark/haunting feelings and emotions into compelling stories and worlds? #AnywayAngie
— Nathan Bransford (@NathanBransford) March 29, 2014
I try to physicalize desperate, longing emotions in some way, so they become tangible. Sometimes it becomes a ghost… #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
Sometimes it becomes a struggle – so Reza’s choice when she discovers the body is a physicalization of her grief… #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
At some point, Grief asks us to make a choice: do we linger, endlessly, become ghosts, or do we step forward into our lives? #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
My job as writer was to throw a physical conflict at Reza that forced her to make a decision about grief and living #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
Same question happens in a smaller way for Charo, who’s traumatized by his own lifestyle and needed a turning point too #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
And that’s what every good story is: A turning point. A crisis. Sometimes many intersecting crises, a crossroads. #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
.@djolder Sometimes I feel like authors shy away from dark feelings for fear of making their audiences uncomfortable. Mistake? #AnywayAngie
— Nathan Bransford (@NathanBransford) March 29, 2014
Shying away from dark feelings can be the right move. Grief is often best addressed from an angle, if that makes sense #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
Because coming head on can be exhausting for reader and writer and no one wants to read pages & pages of grief, it’s too much #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
But it still has to be addressed, otherwise we’re sugarcoating. I set #AnywayAngie at a moment past when the shock was still fresh…
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
but before she’d come to terms with it. So while it’s about grief, and grief walks with Reza, it doesn’t overwhelm the story #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
In short…it’s a balance. But one that we’d do well to think over very strategically. #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
.@djolder How do you go about channeling the voice of a character who is much different than you? #AnywayAngie
— Nathan Bransford (@NathanBransford) March 29, 2014
Part of it is I let the voice speak to me as much as possible. Which maybe sounds simple but really requires us to stfu a lot #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
more than we’re used to, especially as men, esp writing about women. We need to be able to sit w/ uncomfortable truths #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
and not write from a place of ego. Not be defensive. Be aware of how we unconsciously bend narratives to our favor… #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
(i wrote about writing “the Other” recently here: https://t.co/Jdvu4Nf0aH #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
I saw a woman sitting in a crown vic one day while i was working on the ambulance. She was dapper, badass, precise, ferocious #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
Every move was crisp as she took out a cigarette and lit it. These moments are gifts to a writer. #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
when i was a teenager i worked at a diner in harvard sq, a cheesy all american type place. My only friend working there was #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
this punk butch girl that had a night job driving and body guarding call girls. We used to hang out after work, she’s smoke #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
We’d trade stories. None of hers were anything like #AnywayAngie but her personality stayed with me. So those 2 people went into the mixer
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
then I projected my own ideas, dreams, biases and the needs of the story onto them and created Reza, which means “She prays” #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
Ultimately, writing the “other” starts with realizing you aint shit, checking privilege and shutting the fuck up to listen #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
.@djolder Reza is an unconventional “muscle” character. Why don’t we see more characters like this? #AnywayAngie
— Nathan Bransford (@NathanBransford) March 29, 2014
Patriarchy asks us to imagine cis straight men as the most powerful, badass, danger fightingest humans in the world… #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
And while yes, we are responsible for starting and fighting almost every war the world has ever known… #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
Straight, cis-men are also never targeted for their gender or preference, they don’t as a group live in fear of sexual violence #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
And white ones, who we usually see as “muscles” protagonists, are some of the safest, least in danger people ever. #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
whereas women of color face constnt attack on physical, spiritual, emotional and sexual levels, interpersonal and institutional #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
So…there’s a disconnect. As to why: the demographics of the pub industry has a lot to do with it and beyond demographics… #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
the failure of publishing and literature in general to confront its ugly history of racism, sexism, homophobia, transphobia #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
we can’t pretend there isn’t and was never a problem if we want to move forward. But the convo always brings backlash #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
.@djolder You’ve sent over 151,000 tweets. What does Twitter mean to the modern author? #AnywayAngie
— Nathan Bransford (@NathanBransford) March 29, 2014
Twitter had been an amazing opportunity to collaborate, create community, connect…make friends…organize #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
Things that pub advice columns often lump under #Platform or marketing, like we were talking about on here the other day #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
https://t.co/3kVkgDlnr0 here’s the convo about platforms vs community #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
so yes, twitter has helped me reach readers, but it’s so much more than that. I come here to develop ideas when I’m stuck #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
I come up for air when I’ve been writing for hours and need a break. I find camaraderie here, laughter here, solidarity here. #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
When I’m furious or lost twitter makes me laugh, when I’m confused about at topic we suss it out together on here. Community #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
with #AnywayAngie, i asked twitter about guns, subject i don’t know shit about, and had many great convos. I’ve helped folks out with EMS ?s
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
so it’s an exchange. A crossroads, like the city. I think of it as an all night diner sometimes, we all in the mix #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
And finally I’ve made many amazing friends on here that I dearly love and will be close to for the rest of my life… #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
so, Twitter: come for the platform building opportunities, stay for the life-changing earth shattering hilarity and wisdom #AnywayAngie
— Daniel José Older (@djolder) March 29, 2014
Got more questions for @djolder? Ask them with #AnywayAngie. Thanks for joining us! ICYMI here’s his awesome story https://t.co/GohWLJ6IN2
— Nathan Bransford (@NathanBransford) March 29, 2014
Wow! A Twitter interview, almost like reading a Twitter book. Thank you for posting it.
Love this convo. Timing for me is perfect. Twitter has looked overwhelming, but this gives a new perspective. Community. Thanks for sharing this.
Wish we could get a transcript of this for the Twitter-impaired. Not to go all Franzen on you, but that was unreadable despite me really wanting to read it. I'll check out his book though, and I appreciate the thought behind this.
Loved this. A refreshing take on an interview. Honest & raw – 'Ultimately, writing the "other" starts with realizing you aint shit, checking privilege and shutting the fuck up to listen.' So important for writers – if we can pull ourselves out of our own heads for long enough!!! Thanks for all the tips!
Excellent interview, Nathan – thanks for sharing it. As Richard said, this helps me to utilize Twitter in a more productive way. Also, I freakin' loved Daniel's short story – it was truly chilling… creepy and fantastical like Lovecraft, with modern grit and gore.
I've never seen an interview entirely in tweets! Very innovative. There's a poetic quality to his responses that I appreciate. "When you live in a place a while, the streets themselves become like books. Buildings, graffiti, train tracks offer up stories"
Really enjoyed this! I also was wowed by the story. I love dark stuff and he's an awesome writer!