I’m back! Happy ’09, everyone. May all of you win the lottery.
Longtime readers may have noted that in an effort to make this blog more… well, professional, I have cut back on the amount of virtual ink I devote to reality television. Yes, I know. I was attacked by a bout of seriousness. I’m sure I fooled everyone.
But there are times when men are shaped by momentous events that leave us powerless to the whims of fate, and swift, forceful action is required as a result. Such an epochal event is occurring this evening. And that is the premiere of The Bachelor.
NOT JUST ANY BACHELOR. You see, this year’s Bach is Jason, perhaps the most achingly earnest Bachelor in the history of Bachelors. Not only did Jason so wholeheartedly believe in the premise of finding true love on the Bachelorette that even host Chris Harrison had to have been confused, he is also proud father of young Ty, and thus the first single dad Bach.
So many questions. Will Ty give out the roses to the bachelorettes? Will Chris Harrison sit down with Ty for serious interviews? Will the bachelorettes try to bribe Ty with cool toys? Will people feel guilty for deriving so much guilty entertainment at the expense of Ty’s lifetime of therapy bills?
It will be…. something.
Meanwhile:
Call me crazy, but I have been getting stuck on sentences that begin with the word “that.” Not just as in, “That was cool,” I mean actual complex sentences. As in:
That I am asking you this question should tell you that I develop strange aversions from from to time.
or
That he had the smelliest breath in the general vicinity was not in doubt.
Is this a conversational trope I just haven’t heard? Is this some sort of Southern hemisphere thing? Are the kids beginning their sentences with the word “That” and I’m just hopelessly uncool? Can it be done well?
Please give me a ruling.
That there is a child involved in the latest Bachelor is a little unnerving to me. I enjoy reality shows in general and know a few of the Survivors from seasons past, but to toss a child in the midst of that type of madness seems beyond manipulative to me. That they did so is a raw shudder awaiting upon my spine to happen.
That it will be compelling tv is not of question. It shall no doubt be such.
That somebody was impersonating me on Twitter and that the first person on my suspect list – Josephine – turned out NOT to be the impersonator – that I was able to suss out the real imposter – that is why I finally joined Twitter.
Nathan:
Unless it’s dialouge, I think starting a sentence with ‘that’ is just bad writing. It’s awkward and passive. I would avoid it like a tumor.
Back 100 years ago when I went to journalism school, I remember my reporting TA warning us to edit out ALL of the ‘thats.’ Generally speaking, I think it’s a crutch. It’s the written equivalent of saying, “ah, um … know what I’m saying.”
You can indeed begin a sentence with that.
That you are thinking of a TV show instead of thinking about the publishing world is a matter of concern to your fans.
In the above sentence, “That you are thinking of a TV show” is a noun clause used as the subject.
A noun clause may start with that.
(Note: I am a retired English teacher.)
I believe beginning a sentence with “that,” as you have demonstrated, is technically correct. Whether it’s a speedbump to a reader (as in slowing down the flow) is another matter. Personally, I’m against it.
As for the Bachelor… only time will tell on how much little Ty is involved in the lunacy that is TB. Something tells me they will play it up a bit too much for my liking. Kid gloves, people. Kid gloves!
That we develop strange aversions from time to time is undeniable. Recently I developed one regarding the use of “as if” and opted for the equally acceptable (at least by English grammar rules) “as though”.
Just the other day in the latest MS, I caught myself writing “as if” so I think I’m recovering.
That this too shall pass should be comforting. 😉
That I am confused is an understatement.
Historical romance dialogue, maybe.
I agree that beginning a sentence with “That” sounds awkward. It is only slightly less annoying than opening with “The fact that.”
I don’t know about everyone else, but that at the beginning of a sentence just sounds awkward. It sounds…weird.
And this season of the Bachelor does sound good. I saw a preview of it on Saturday, and Jason might get a crazy stalker in this season! I don’t usually watch it, but I might this year.
While it may be technically correct to use a noun phrase beginning with “that” at the start of a sentence, the examples you posted were awkward and wordy. It might be OK to use “that” at the start of a sentence occasionally if it suits your writing style, but in general I would reword to make the sentence easier to understand. And that is all I have to say about “that.” 😉
The cases you’ve given are all examples of beginning a sentence with a conjunction. Most manuals of style discourage, if not prohibit, such constructions. That said, if used sparingly and consciously, beginning a sentence with a conjunction can be a useful construction.
There’s an entertaining exchange in the movie “Finding Forrester” on the subject, by the way.
Agree with JW. It’s a substitute for “the fact that.” Probably technically okay, but I think you only get like one per lifetime.
I almost want to hate it. But I don’t.
I’ve seen the commercials for the new Bachelor. I’m usually not a fan of the show, but I do find myself already wishing for success for the bachelor because he’s a single guy with a kid.
I’m not going to bash beginning a complex sentence with ‘that’, but I’m not sure why one would do that. Also, I’m sure there are crafty writers who can pull off just about anything thing even with the style police watching.
As long as it is grammatically correct and not confusing, I don’t have a problem with using that at the beginning of a sentence. I don’t think it is necessary to use that twice though.
I have to admit to kind of freaking when I saw this. I quickly scanned my latest posts to make sure I hadn’t strayed. But then I got to thinking about it and there is a certain erudite rhythm to the phrasing that is not necessarily alien to my writing. It would have to be tempered by the lyricism of the moment, but I bet if I dig through my stuff, I could find some uses of it.
Eek!
There’s nothing particularly wrong with starting a sentence with ‘that’, it’s just a bit too 19th/20th century for my liking.
That your newfound turn toward seriousness might preclude your continued discussion of The Hills (and dare I add The City?) distresses me.
word verification: cultings – as in, “With Nathan’s departure from the scene, the firmament of Hills cultings grows dimmer.”
I have a problem with “that” everywhere, not just at the beginning of sentences. Awhile back, Janet Reid asked people to get rid of as many “thats” in their manuscripts as possible. I went from about 80,000 words to 200.
But enough about that. I think the new Bach seems like a good dude. I read he visited a child psych before going on the initial Bach, so I’m sure he’s doing all he can to shelter litte Ty’s brain.
Have you seen Momma’s Boy? Oh man, that (there’s “that” again) is one crazy reality show. I have to take a shower after watching it, I feel so dirty. (And, yet, I still watch it).
I don’t think beginning a sentence with “that” is necessarily a problem, as long as the writing still flows. It’s been done well, even by Shakespeare. Extraneous conjunctions and prepositions drag writing down no matter where they’re placed, at the beginning or middle of sentences.
It’s like a literary speed bump.
Welcome back and enjoy The Bachelor! I’m more of a House girl.
Nathan,
I don’t think that we can exclude ‘that’ as a sentence beginner. That is not to say that excessive use of ‘that’ in the beginning of sentences can’t become tiresome. It can. And does. But there are times when ‘that’ is the best way to begin. Any repetitive word use can become tiresome and crutch like when over used. That’s just they way it is. So I agree that writers should avoid awkward crutches, simply outlawing one doesn’t really solve the problem.
The solution is better proof reading. Probably including reading some of your work out loud to make sure you don’t sound jumbled and clunky. That’s the way I try to avoid falling into this problem.
Nathan – I read your blog religiously, yet rarely comment due to my “newbie” writer status; I prefer to read and gain wisdom from the wings. However, I had to weigh in on The Bachelor. I am so excited about Single Dad Jason! If I was single, I totally would have signed up for the show. I spent weeks downing the “damn snowboarder” after DeAnna’s shocking decision last season. My husband was quite vindicated since he is a snowboarder and was rooting for Jesse all along. I loved DeAnna, don’t get me wrong, but I think she found her match, and now it is time for Jason to find his.
You cannot begin to IMAGINE how excited I am about the premiere of The Bachelor tonight. Well, actually, I’m sure you can. I’ve had it written in my planner for WEEKS. It’s going to be the most dramatic season yet!
I think this year I might have a Bachelor Finale Viewing Party at the end of the season. Shots for everyone! Shots with roses in them!
That starting a sentence with that annoys you is not suprising.
On the one hand, it is perfectly appropriate when writing Latin or Greek,
But on the other hand, By Jove, it is poor style in English!
Grammatically correct does not always mean “well written”
As you all sit at the edge of your seats anticipating the Bachelor, I am chiming in here for the show Monk. The second half of the new season 7 begins this friday with a new episode (that I’ve already seen, thanks to being able to attend the Paley event in California on 12/2) about Monk’s half brother. I can you it’s every bit of hilarious!
Hand to God! rofl.
The particular construction is one that is colloquial at best. I think it can be junked without losing much. That’s not to say there aren’t other ways of using it correctly, as Becky pointed out.
Incidentally, voting for 2008 Weblog Awards is about to begin (and should have by now). My blog Barataria is up for Best Culture Blog and our own Nathan Bransford is up for Best Literature Blog.
Thanks for your support!
Well, I’ll admit it – I’ve used “that” to begin a sentence. It depends on the narrative voice.
I have never watched The Bachelor but I just may start…
Happy 2009 to you and all the blog readers, Nathan! it’s going to be a great year!
J-school is still the same (or it was four years ago when I was there). “That” is verboten, as is “the fact that”. I hate that phrase with an all-consuming passion. It should be banned from writing for all eternity cause it just sucks the life out of prose.
BTW, word verification is a Real Word today: spine.
You could do it–if you’re Charles Dickens.
It may be grammatically correct, but it’s exceedingly awkward for contemporary writing.
This is the first I’m hearing of That. Though it would drive me bananas, too.
That there should be a Bachelor pool, similar to the ANTM challenge, is not even a question.
Beginning a sentence with ‘that’ in the context you give isn’t wrong. However, as someone said, it *is* passive writing, and as such should be used sparingly and only when of utmost effect.
That is possibly the stupidest thing I ever heard. That said, there may be times were starting a sentence with That is appropriate.
That the way to the bachelor is through is kid is a given. That, however, can come to no good in the end.
That’s all I have to say except…
That my verification word was SPOCKSH is compelling me to add the salutation “Live long and prosper.”
Yuck on “that”, cross it out whenever it’s not necessary, it’s lazy writing.
Yipee on the Bachelor! I can’t believe she passed on him last time. I had Jason picked as the winner from the first day. This is a “must” see season. I can’t say the same for Rock of Love Bus Tour my husband had me watch last night.
I also recommend The City with Whitney.
While I’m sure that it’s perfectly acceptable to begin a sentence with “that”, I’d rather not see it. Aside from being passive, it’s kind of a stumbling block that prevents the rest of the sentence from having any kind of natural flow.
If I encounter the words “that,” “as” or “with” in my own writings, that’s an open invitation to revise the sentence if I’m not being clear.
I feel a surprising neutrality about beginning a sentence with “That.” Of course, I suspect that since I stopped teaching Freshman Composition I see a lot fewer “experiments in writing” than you do.
Hey, how are you doing?
That there are so many reality TV fans lurking about on a literature blog is a bit distressing. Shouldn’t we be WRITING instead of immersing ourselves in the worst of the worst on the tube? (At least watch something scripted. There are starving writers in India, you know. 😉 )
Give me a That at the beginning of a sentence any day over one indiscriminately stuck in the middle where it really isn’t needed. (Recovering journalist here, too.)
Wow.
I just clicked on comments just to see how many of your witty readers would leave a comment starting with the word that.
:-I
WELCOME BACK! Happy New Year! I have so missed your fresh take on life and reality TV and writing.
I hope with all that is in me that they keep that adorable Ty out of things as much as possible.
The beginning “That” can go jump, but I have a certain love for my indirect statement “that” among others. I know he doesn’t have to be there, but sometimes I just like him there.
Here’s a thought for your “Can I get a ruling?” thing. Being the old fossil that I am, I’ve only recently become aware that 2 spaces between sentences is a horror and annoys some people in the extreme. Who knew? Is this the new generation gap? Does that glaring, gaping hole between sentences bug you?
FYI: lotusgirl was lotusloq–I changed up all my blogging stuff so… new name.
A bit passive, a bit British, and certainly speed-bumpish, but I would never stop someone from being creative with language if it managed to fit the space.
Ditch the Bachelor, Nathan, and head on over to VH1. The reality shows there can be described a bit like Satanists describe their religion in comparison to the rest of the world’s: they know the concept is mostly bull, they just don’t bother hiding it. 🙂
unness n. 1. used to describe the condition of wishing one was never born. Having dropped what would have been the winning pass in the end zone, the receiver was overcome with a feeling of unness.
That it may be gramatically correct, doesn’t mean it still isn’t annoying to the reader to read a sentence that starts with that. See what I mmean?
(Yippee, Nathan’s back!)
Starting a sentence with “that” should be deliberate and done for effect (as many comments here have demonstrated). Otherwise, it’s just sloppy, and sloppy writing is always wrong.
THAT:
For dialog, no problem. “That way,” she said.
For narrative, trickier, but it can work. Especially as a fragment.
Joe tossed back the triple shot. That which does not kill you, and all that.
Or:
That had to be the worst case of agorophibia this hospital has ever seen.
Lot of ways to do that.
I’ll be watching The Bachelor tonight, too. The show is always about the contestants, I find . . . you always have a crazy stalker type, a “good” girl, and the girl everyone loves to hate.
Sentences with that don’t bother me, but maybe it’s all my British literature influence??
When I first became a newspaper reporter, my editor struck out any sentence I wrote that began with That is/was, There is/were, or It is/was. She couldn’t rationalize her objection, so I assume it was a matter of taste–one that I shared and so appreciated her keeping an eye out for. Later in life I understood better what was going on when I read a book called “Style: Ten Lessons in Clarity and Grace” by Joseph Williams. He doesn’t argue against starting a sentence with that, there or it, but he argues against turning verbs into nouns (nominalizations), using abstractions as the subject and using weak verbs. I eventually realized that you will tend to write the really bad stuff if you start a sentence on the wrong foot–i.e. with that, there and it. Those words aren’t in themselves what usually confuses or annoys readers, but they right away rob of you of a clear, physically alive subject and box you into using a weak verb.
Thus my editor’s habit of avoiding any sentence that begins that way. I’ve found that that, there and it at the beginning of sentences are great flags for other syntax problems. I regularly go through my drafts and look for those flags and often end up rewriting the sentence, usually with a character as the subject and an action as the verb.
Starting a sentence with THAT should be reserved for the very skillful, the very colloquial, and the very reluctant.
My own pet bugaboo, and the one I find myself striking most often, is JUST. That every time I think I’ve just about got it expunged from my vocabulary it sneaks right back, is just too frustrating.
If a given manuscript starts a LOT of sentences that way — especially within a given N pages — sure, it’s awkward and probably an affectation.
But (don’t you just HATE sentences starting with a conjunction?!?) it’s really not too too awful, I think. (It’s better than “The fact that…”) Reversing the word order to eliminate can actually change the meaning and/or tone of a sentence, subtly. Consider:
That I am asking you this question should tell you that I develop strange aversions from from to time.
can be recast as:
I develop strange aversions from time to time, as you should be able to tell just from my asking the question.
The first “awkward” form suspends to the end of the sentence the notion of strange aversions. To my mind, this transitions more easily into a further discussion of the aversions. The second form seems to emphasize the writer-reader relationship — “You DO get this, don’t you?!?” — in a rather self-conscious way, momentarily tabling what is the more important subject at hand.
And I also think it’s possible to overthink all of this. Whether I’m overthinking, you are, or we both are, I leave to your judgment. 🙂
(Welcome back!)